Building a Practice Around Your Expertise

Dr. Carey Campbell

Travel surgery got such a bad rap, or gets a bad rap, because people go to, like, Atlanta and Miami, like, chop shops, and are there for 24 hours and are flying back. What we now can explain to patients is that you're not coming to see me for 24 hours. This is at least a, you know, 10-day, maybe two-week experience, and we can do it safely.

Erica Crawford

I'm here today with Dr. Carey Campbell. We're here live at The Aesthetic Meeting. Thank you so much for coming.

Dr. Carey Campbell

Glad to be here. Thanks for having me.

Erica Crawford

Yeah, gosh. You made a huge change recently. So you were in Memphis at a very large practice, and you just went all the way to Philadelphia, right? And joined with Dr. Ron Stark. And that's a big change for you, and I want to— I was curious, like, what was that like for you, going to a different city, your patients, large practice to a smaller practice? Like, what is that like?

Dr. Carey Campbell

It's a huge change, but it's been, um, all that I really hoped it would be. I loved being in a large practice for a long time. It allowed me, um, stability, and it was a great place to start my career. I don't think I would be the surgeon that I was today if I hadn't started where I was. And it was great from a family perspective.

But now, um, you know, as my practice has sort of become more niche and I'm focusing mostly on facial surgery and so a little bit of breast surgery, I— our practices just evolve and are different, and at this point it made sense for me to be in a truly aesthetic, cosmetic-only practice. And being in the smaller practice allows me to give a little bit more of a concierge feel to my patients, which I think, you know, as much as a large practice tries, you're trying to accommodate so many different surgeons' feelings, um, financial incentives, like, you know, there's different dynamics at play in a large group.

And I was ready to join a really good friend, and we have the ability to sort of make this very niche, concierge-feeling, um, practice for patients, and that was the big impetus for my move. And it's also exciting to be in a bigger city.

Erica Crawford

Yeah.

Dr. Carey Campbell

You know, I mean, Memphis was home for me, and I loved it, and I just— I don't know. I think the opportunities that a city like Philadelphia has— it's such a growing city. It's like one of the fastest-growing job markets. And so, just in terms of being able to capture more patients, grow the business, and also then just opportunities for my family.

Erica Crawford

Oh, that's amazing. Oh. How did your existing patients in Memphis sort of take the move?

Dr. Carey Campbell

Um, I mean, it was really heartwarming and bittersweet. A lot of them are really sad, and I'm sad to leave those people. I mean, at the end of the day, we do this because— or I do this because I love my patients.

Erica Crawford

Mhm.

Dr. Carey Campbell

And a lot of my facial patients I have relationships with. You know, they all have my cell phone number, and I get texts from them and photos. So, I mean, like, they took it hard. But what's been the most complimentary and flattering thing that I think has happened is that I've had so many of my patients move their care up to Philadelphia. I think that, especially with facial surgery, patients have become used to the concept that they may travel for it.

Erica Crawford

Yes, absolutely.

Dr. Carey Campbell

And that what's in your own backyard maybe great, but if it's not, and you have a connection with another surgeon, that it's okay to travel, and it can be done safely.

Erica Crawford

Yes.

Dr. Carey Campbell

I think that travel surgery got such a bad rap, or gets a bad rap, because people go to, like, Atlanta and Miami, like, chop shops, and are there for 24 hours and are flying back.

Erica Crawford

Mhm.

Dr. Carey Campbell

You know, and unsafe things happen, and I think what we now can explain to patients is that you're not coming to see me for 24 hours.

Erica Crawford

No.

Dr. Carey Campbell

This is at least a, you know, 10-day, maybe two-week experience, and we can do it safely, because that's the acute period we really need to take care of patients. And technology makes it such that I can FaceTime, I can, you know, do a teleconference— I mean, a telemed, you know, visit with my patients.

And so, I, you know— eight of my patients have already moved their surgery from Memphis to Philadelphia just for this year. So, it's great. And, um, you know, the patients who really have a connection with me, I think it's, like, things like, you're just a plane ride away. It's not going to be that bad.

Erica Crawford

That's lovely, actually.

Dr. Carey Campbell

Yeah. And then, you know, this is also part of— I mean, I feel so fortunate to be able to say this, but part of what gave me the confidence to make— this is the right time to make this move— is in the last, probably, I don't know, year to two years, my practice has evolved to have a lot of traveling patients to me in Memphis. But then there would be things that were difficult with them trying to get to Memphis to see me, um, and just the accommodations and the experience I wanted to offer them if they were going to be willing to travel to see me. Um, I feel like I can do that better in Philadelphia.

So, you know, I was seeing patients from New Jersey, Florida, California, North Carolina. Like, these are all these wonderful women that actually did have a connection to me through Memphis somehow. But, you know, then their friends talk, and so it's— now traveling to see me has become kind of the norm, which is nice.

Erica Crawford

That's really amazing. Um, you mentioned earlier that you have a focus on face, right? Face, with facial plastic surgery. I'm curious, how did you get there, right?

Dr. Carey Campbell

Yeah. So, it all started when Dr. Stark and I were residents together, honestly. We worked under, um, a man named Fritz Barton, who is long retired— but actually he retired 10 years ago. But he and a man named Sam Hamra were, like, the godfathers of deep plane facial surgery. And, unfortunately, I don't think they get the credit that they deserve, because they weren't in the ENT facial plastics world. They weren't in the— they were in the plastic surgery world. Um, but their papers go back to, like, the '70s, '80s. There's some great papers in the '90s.

But they were our mentors, right? And so I fell in love with it, and then Dr. Barton encouraged me to pursue a facial fellowship in New York. So he helped facilitate that with me. So I did the Manhattan Eye, Ear, and Throat, uh, facial fellowship with, uh, Sherrell Aston and Dan Baker. Steve Levine was there. Those are the names that you would know.

Erica Crawford

Yep.

Dr. Carey Campbell

And, um, it was an amazing year. And I really fell in love with facial surgery, right? That's the moment that it happened, I think, for me— was those last few years of my residency and then my fellowship.

And I will say, though, in the last three years, as much as I wish, like, some of the facial plastic surgeons would give more credit to, like, those two pioneers, I have learned more from the facial plastic surgeons than I ever anticipated that I would. And I think an openness to realizing that our two fields, like, really need to collaborate more— and that when we work together, we both are smarter and better and take care of our patients better— is really, there's so much room for growth and opportunity there. So, I mean, I think you see a lot more facelift courses happening that are across specialty, and those courses have, like, just totally changed my practice for the last two or three years, I'd say.

Erica Crawford

Wow, that's incredible. Well, I've seen your work. You do phenomenal facelifts.

Dr. Carey Campbell

Thank you. Thank you.

Erica Crawford

Um, you know, the next subject, it's kind of a funny one to approach, but it's something I can relate to, right? Is that you're a female plastic surgeon, and there is a big lack of those in the space. Although it definitely has improved over the last few years. Um, and it's something I can relate to because there's, give or take, 35 medical marketing companies in the space that you're going to walk around here at Aesthetic Society and see. Um, and every single one of the presidents and/or CEOs of those companies are men. Yeah. I am quite literally the only female.

Dr. Carey Campbell

Oh, wow. That's very impressive.

Erica Crawford

As president here for Influx. But so it's a factor in this space. It's an interesting factor in this space. And I am curious to see, as a female plastic surgeon, has that made things more difficult for you? Has it made, in some cases, things easier for you? What's that been like for you?

Dr. Carey Campbell

Um, well, just so that you're aware, while only 20% of practicing plastic surgeons are female, 60% of residents are female.

Erica Crawford

Oh gosh, that's so beautiful. I love it.

Dr. Carey Campbell

Um, get ready. Ready or not.

Erica Crawford

Excited. That's such a great— and I know it's been improving, and I've seen it at the residents forum and I've seen it at ASPS as well. I didn't know it was 60%. That's— wow.

Dr. Carey Campbell

Well, I learned that statistic yesterday at the women's aesthetic symposium. Thank you for being a contributor to our swag bag. I love it.

Erica Crawford

Um—

Dr. Carey Campbell

But it's, um, it's growing. And, you know, this is controversial, because the last thing I want to say is that my male colleagues are in any way inferior to me. I mean, I don't feel that way.

Erica Crawford

No.

Dr. Carey Campbell

I've had plastic surgery myself, and men have operated on me. So, you know, it's like, I'm not saying anything about that. I think that it's really patient specific, you know, and that's what it comes down to.

In my current practice, I have— there's two women in— or in my previous practice, I guess I should say. There's two women and there's three men, right? And when a patient walks in the office, for better or worse, I can tell if that patient's going to see a woman or if that patient's going to see a man. I'm not going to go into the criteria that I can tell, but there's certain women that really jive with a male plastic surgeon, and that is right for them. But then there are other women that, like, they just identify with my experience in a way—

Erica Crawford

Mhm.

Dr. Carey Campbell

—and I identify with theirs. Like, you know, I'm sitting there talking to my patients about, like, their perimenopausal issues, and, like, if they're going to be able to stop their estrogen and their progesterone, and how they're going to feel, you know, around surgery. And I'm like, please don't stop your hormones. And they're like, oh, it's nice to hear a surgeon say, like, it's going to be okay, because I couldn't go off that. And I'm like, I can't imagine, like, asking my patients to do that.

So I just think that there's a little bit of relatability, you know, like, um, that as a woman I have to my patients. It doesn't mean that my male colleagues don't relate to their patients well. You know what I mean? They just have a different dynamic than I do. Um, and, you know, Dr. Stark, who's my partner, is, I think, a fantastic surgeon and doctor. So, I mean, I have nothing but the kindest things to say about him.

And I just think you have to figure out as a patient what jives with you. But I'm excited to be a woman in the facial surgery field. There are not enough. There's not enough.

Erica Crawford

Simply not enough.

Dr. Carey Campbell

In facial plastics, actually.

Erica Crawford

Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

Dr. Carey Campbell

I mean, I think Elizabeth Chance has really taken, um, the flag of, like, female facial surgeons, and she has given such legitimacy. Because I think women— for a long time, it's a tedious, hard surgery, and it's kind of like microsurgery. Like, it's one of those things that you're committing your day to that patient.

Erica Crawford

Yes.

Dr. Carey Campbell

And, um, it's a lot from, like, a lifestyle perspective for a woman to take on, I guess, is kind of the thing. But, like, you know, I love that surgery. I could spend all day doing it every day. So, I think you just, as a woman, you have to find what really jives with you. You have Gabriele Miotto in, um, Atlanta— is the same way. She's a fantastic female facial surgeon, and I think that we'll see more and more of them.

Um, I hope to see more and more of them on the podium talking at conferences. I think that that will really help. It's just, you know, like, as much as I wish it weren't the case, sometimes our life priorities are different than our male colleagues, you know?

Erica Crawford

Yeah, it's a fact. It's a fact. And the truth is that one could argue it's not just about plastic surgery. It's a very intensive career.

Dr. Carey Campbell

Correct. Yeah.

Erica Crawford

Right, time-intensive career. I come to these conferences and I'm standing next to, you know, my colleagues like Adam and Max, right?

Dr. Carey Campbell

Right.

Erica Crawford

And people will go up to me and go, "Who's taking care of your baby at home?" They're not asking Adam and Max.

Dr. Carey Campbell

They got kids, too?

Erica Crawford

No. They're not asking them. My husband does. And this is my fifth conference in six weeks, and, you know, bless his heart, he does it every time. And that's our modern relationship.

Dr. Carey Campbell

I know. I know. People may think my relationship with my husband is non-traditional, but, I mean, he's been undeniably the rock that has supported my career. And I couldn't do it without him, just like a lot of the men that are here couldn't do it without their wives.

Erica Crawford

Yeah.

Dr. Carey Campbell

Um, but my husband is great. I have two little girls that I love very much, and it's nice to get to FaceTime them and do all those things when I'm here. But, um, he is, fortunately, really embraced the role of, like, being a great dad. You know, and I'm a great mom.

Erica Crawford

Yeah, you are a great mom. I'm a great mom. But our husbands are also phenomenal dads. We're really, really good.

Dr. Carey Campbell

Really, really good dads.

Erica Crawford

Above average, you know? I just have to be honest, and it's nice.

Dr. Carey Campbell

It's funny. It's like, sometimes I take for granted how unusual that is. And then I hear other women talk about, like, how much their husband does or doesn't do, and I'm like, I can't tell them how much my husband does, because they'll be like, "Where did you find him?" You know, like—

Erica Crawford

There's some things I can't, like, mentally conceive of. Like, I'm like— he's always took care of diapers, and— and so have I. We're very— He has his own career.

Dr. Carey Campbell

Right. So does my husband.

Erica Crawford

Yeah, it's not like he's a stay-at-home dad or anything like that. He definitely has a very serious career, and he does quite well for himself. Um, just that we're in it together.

Dr. Carey Campbell

Right. Exactly. We're partners.

Erica Crawford

We're partners. Yeah, that's it. Which allows us to also be as busy as we are, right? Which is really nice, which I think is some of the things that would have to change for more—

Dr. Carey Campbell

Women.

Erica Crawford

More women. And more— back to the original thing, more female plastic surgeons.

Dr. Carey Campbell

Right. Exactly. And I mean—

Erica Crawford

It is an intensive career.

Dr. Carey Campbell

My husband is proud of me when I tell him, like, "Oh, I got asked to speak on this panel. I'm going to have to go to this conference." He's like, "That's fantastic news. You know, like, I'm so proud of you." And to have the support of your family to do that, it's critical.

Erica Crawford

Yeah, and, you know, we're setting good examples for our little girls too, which is actually really nice. It does allow us to do things like take them for a trip for a couple weeks and do— there are certain things that it does allow for that will result in more time with them, too.

Dr. Carey Campbell

Yeah, absolutely. It doesn't have to be all work.

Erica Crawford

No, it doesn't have to be all work at all.

Dr. Carey Campbell

Yeah, exactly.

Erica Crawford

Well, this has been so great. Thank you so much. And we're going to have a fun time. We have a few days together at the estate.

Dr. Carey Campbell

I know, it'll be great. Thanks again.

Erica Crawford

All right, thank you.